Interview – Page 5 – That Happy Certainty

Ministry, Interview

Primer, Theological ‘Fast-food’ & Staying Sharp Together – An Interview with David Shaw

Along with the inflatable crocodile and Kubb, I tend to find that summer holidays are a good time to prioritise packing some fiction into my suitcase. (Sadly life somehow feels too chaotic the rest of the year to follow through on a novel – or perhaps it’s just that now I get most of my story-telling through the medium of the screen rather than the page?) But one of the exceptions to the fiction rule in this summer’s suitcase was Primer. Published just twice a year, Primer is eighty (very readable) pages “designed to help those in church leadership stay theologically sharp and engaged”. And it’s brilliant!

Primer was only launched last year, but I think it’s a gem of a resource for those in positions of leadership in a church to marinate on together (anyone from pastors, elders, wardens, small-group leaders, staff-team, PCCs, etc). Its editor is David Shaw, who is part-time Tutor in New Testament and Greek at Oak Hill College and part-time Theological Advisor for FIEC (The Fellowship of Independent Evangelical Churches). David kindly took the time to answer some questions about Primer and the vision behind it.

David, for those of who’ve not comes across Primer yet, what exactly is it? It’s not quite a magazine, and it’s not quite a journal – it definitely looks too cool for that. So tell us a little bit about the story behind Primer.

Sure. The basic conviction behind Primer is that good theology is vital in church leadership. As Kevin Vanhoozer says, pastors are called to be “ministers of reality” – helping the church and the world to understand what God has done through Jesus Christ. To do that church leaders need to have a good grasp of theological truths and know how those truths shape life and ministry. One of the key aims of Primer then is to help anyone involved in ministry to have a better grasp of what God has done through Jesus Christ.

Primer is published by FIEC once every six months, taking one theological issue at a time. So far we’ve published issues on Scripture (Nov 2015) and the doctrine of sin (May 2016). In each issue we have articles that survey the contemporary scene, reflecting on the debates and reviewing the best resources available. We also re-print a classic historical text from church history on the topic in every issue. We want to help pastors draw down the treasures of church history, but we also know those texts can be intimidating. For that reason, we ask someone to annotate each historical text, putting it in context, explaining tricky bits, and reflecting on its significance for today. Then towards the end, there will be articles or interviews that focus more on the difference that topic makes to pastoral ministry and church life.

I guess a lot of us involved in church leadership might find time to attend a couple of conferences each year, perhaps making it through the occasional book (and starting a few more!). In the busyness of ministry the idea of ‘Further Reading’ often seems limited to flicking through whatever blog posts and online articles come our way! Why would you say Primer is worth investing in?

Great question! Two things to say here. First of all, because good theology is central to church leadership we want to encourage church leaders away from that kind of online fast food. There’s lots of good stuff online of course, but it’s often overwhelming, distracting and disconnected. In addition, most theological issues can’t be dealt with in 140 characters or a blog post. They do take time, and so we want to encourage people to settle down and dig a bit deeper. We’ve even tried to help that in the design of Primer – it’s supposed to feel like something you enjoy, value, and spend time over. On the other hand we know church leaders are under pressure and that’s why we worked hard to save them time by giving them an 80 page digest that focus on one topic, boils down the issues and keeps the realities of ministry in view. That’s why we hope it’s worth investing in, putting the kettle on, and pulling up a chair.

Who would you say Primer is for?

So far I’ve been talking about church leaders and others involved in ministry. We have written it with them in mind, but Primer is also designed to be a training tool to raise up new leaders. The artwork and layout make the topics accessible, but it’s stretching enough to train men and women to think and serve with a clearer theological framework. There’s also a website (primerhq.com) which has discussion resources for each article.

It’s been a few months now since Primer was launched. What’s your take on how it’s been received – and how are churches are using it?

We’re still working hard to get the word out and to help people understand what Primer is – as you say it falls somewhere between a magazine, journal and textbook) but we’ve been really pleased to hear how Primer has been received. I’ve heard from many church leaders how much they appreciate the combination of depth and the practical outworkings of doctrine. I’ve heard of pastors reading it with their assistants, elders or leadership teams, and some church book groups using it too.

For your second and latest issue you’ve focused on the topic of sin. In some ways that seems quite a bold option. Maybe we think we don’t particularly need to read 80 pages about sin, or we might just have reservations about suggesting something on that topic to our leadership team. What made you choose this emphasis? And what would you say to someone who feels the pull of those responses?

I recently read that “it is impossible to have an adequate conception of sin without an adequate conception of God.” I think the reverse is true as well. We will not be able to understand who God is and how amazing the gospel is until we grasp the reality of our sin. In that way understanding sin fuels worship. That would be a good reason to spend time thinking about it. Another is that we don’t often reflect on how to communicate the reality of sin. This was a particular focus in that issue of Primer. So there are articles that focus on how we can better communicate the Bible’s rich and varied account of sin, and there are articles that help us engage with issues like addiction and a ‘victim culture’ that denies sin and thinks everything wrong with the world is someone else’s fault.

One of the things I’ve enjoyed about the two issues so far is the blend of the types of articles: interview, book review, pastoral issues. What’s the thinking behind that?

Basically we want Primer to be a one-stop shop for whatever doctrine we’re covering. You can find book reviews and academic articles about topics, but it’s really hard to find something that combines depth with coverage of the best resources of past and present and rubs all that in to church life.

Absolutely – and I think you’re nailing it. So tell us what we can look forward to with Primer in the future?

The third issue (due out in Nov 2016) will be on the topic of gender and sexuality, with contributions from Ed Shaw, Sam Allberry, Sharon James, and Alastair Roberts. We’ll be looking in depth at Genesis 1-2 to see how that speaks to the issues of homosexuality, same-sex marriage and transgenderism. Articles will also outline the ways in which Christians are responding to these issues and help us wrestle with the medical, theological and public policy aspects of them.

The fourth issue (May 2017) will be on the doctrine of justification in the year that will see the 500^th anniversary of Luther’s 95 theses. We’ll have Matthew Barrett, Gregg Allison and David Starling among others helping us to understand the history of the doctrine and its significance for the Christian life and ministry.

Thanks for your time David. Just finally, for someone looking to get hold of Primer, or perhaps order a few copies for the leadership team, what’s the best way to do that?

You can order Primer from The Good Book Company, and you’ll find it on bookstalls at Keswick, Word Alive, the EMA and other Christian conferences.

You can follow David on Twitter here.

September 23, 2016 by robinham

Ministry, Culture, Interview

Life Explored, Telling Stories & The Character of God – An Interview with Nate Morgan-Locke

It was great fun to chat with Nate Morgan-Locke recently, co-writer and co-presenter of the new Life Explored resource. Nate is an associate evangelist for Christianity Explored Ministries and serves on the staff team at St Bart’s Church, Bath. We talked through the vision and story behind LE, as well as the value in telling stories as part of our communication of the gospel.

**Nate, Life Explored is now released and out there. In a nutshell, what is it?**

We all want to be happy. And yet lasting happiness is so hard to find. Life Explored is basically a seven session series, featuring a combination of short films and Bible interaction, which seeks to show how our deepest desires for happiness can only be satisfied in one person, Jesus Christ.

So, talk us through the story that’s led you & Barry to write & produce this?

I think it was way back in December 2010 that we first started exploring the idea of what would eventually go on to become Life Explored. At that point we were realising that you’d get some people who’d done Christianity Explored but they weren’t quite ready for Discipleship Explored. And so it felt like there was a gap. We’re also aware that people are exploring Christianity with very little sense of the Bible’s big picture. Fast-forward to 2013 and Barry Cooper [co-author & co-presenter], Alison Mitchell and I were crafting some Bible studies for this material, and we just began realising that at the heart of people’s confusion about Christianity was how they understood God.

And so over time, as we were reflecting on how to take this forward, we just became convinced that the character of God was what we really wanted to spend our time helping people to see. I think so often – even as Christians – we can spend more time looking at the window rather than through the window. We get caught up discussing the finger prints or rain drops on the window pane. In other words, we know things about God but we don’t focus in on God himself: Father, Son, and Spirit. That’s really the beating heart of Life Explored: ‘Let me tell you about who God is; let me show you him from the Bible. Do you see how stunning he is compared to everything else?’

And how did that vision then become a reality?

Well, at some point in the process Barry & I decided that we wanted to use film to really open up some of these issues and get under people’s skin. Each session would tell a story through film, as well as having filmed teaching material. Barry & I wrote the material, and we present it with Rico Tice. But we also brought in Dot&Cross to help turn our ideas for these stories into film. They’ve previously worked on Tim Keller’s The Prodigal God and Francis Chan’s Basic. We spent all of last summer filming – mostly in the States, although one film is set on location in India and another in Japan. The production team and film crew have also come from those locations, so in that sense it has become a very international project!

As someone involved in evangelism and youth ministry, was it a big adjustment going from writing talks to writing film scripts?

Ha, yes & no! Barry & I – we both enjoy writing short stories, and I’ve always enjoyed using stories in my preaching. Even writing holiday club material for children, such as Epic Explorers, we’re always trying to use compelling story as a way of people connecting with what’s going on in God’s word. So in that sense it was just an extension and a honing of something that was already very much a part of us.

What would your advice be for someone who wants to get better at telling stories?

Of course, if you’re preaching God’s word then exegesis must come first. You can’t do anything without that, working really hard to understand the Bible passage and its message and context. But once you’ve done that, you’re then well placed to feel the passage’s tone & dynamic. You start to think, “well it’s a little bit like this… this kind of interaction, or this kind of moment.” And as you unpack that and play with it, suddenly you’ve got a story, a story that’s working to highlight that moment, or that feeling. You get a ‘wow’ moment that sheds light and helps people to connect with the Bible passage.

For example, in our church we’ve been preaching through Ezekiel this summer. I was preaching on Ezekiel 8-9, where God comes in vengeance and judgment on his people for the way they’ve profaned his temple. Now, to our ears that might initially seem harsh. But story can help people understand. I ended up crafting the story of this newly-wed couple who spend time buying and building a new bed from Ikea for their first marital home. A few years later the husband has an affair and the first question the wife asks is, “please tell me you didn’t have her in our bed?” And he admits he has. And there’s that emotional punch, because we suddenly see why the temple is so precious. This is where God is with his people, and you need to feel the back-story, the sense of a joyful creation, to feel the sense of shock and horror at what they’ve done.

That said, I’d also say that everyone needs to find their own voice – especially in preaching. Don’t try and be someone else.

**Tell us who you see Life Explored as being for?**

Ultimately, we hope it’s a way of presenting the good news of Christianity to those who’ve never heard it or engaged with it. We hope it’s especially engaging for those who’d not consider themselves to be religious. We’ve invested in these seven films because we hope they might make for a more accessible starting point. Story has great power to expose. A classic example in the Bible is when the prophet Nathan approaches king David, who has just got the husband of the girl he fancies killed so he can have her. Nathan tells a story as a way of convicting David – and it works. Just as we might make our church buildings accessible with ramps and hand rails and clear fonts, so we want to make our presentation of the gospel accessible.

I think too that lots of our evangelism has traditionally presented our sin in terms of law-breaking, but I think some people are struggling to relate to this. That doesn’t mean it’s not true. But instead we’ve taken another biblical angle on sin, that of idolatry. I think where we’re at as a culture means people can identify much more readily with this idea of making your life all about something.

We also hope LE is geared up for those who may never have read the Bible. That’s why we survey the whole biblical plot line, from creation through to fall, redemption, and new creation.

But we also pray LE will be an encouragement to Christians. In fact that’s been a joy to see in some of the trials we’ve run with the draft material. We’ve seen Christians suddenly go, “wow, God is like this?”

The tagline for LE is ‘what’s the best gift God could give you?’ and you began by talking about how we all are on a search for happiness. Tell us why you focus in on that?

I think we were sitting in a pub garden in west London, and we were just playing round with how we might present some ‘diagnostic questions’ to help people see we all worship something. And I turned to Barry and I said, “You’ve just got to ask ‘what’s the best gift God could give you?'” And suddenly we realised there’s a sense in which how you answer that question will totally reveal what you love and what you live for. That’s where we think our happiness will be found. If you want to find out what people worship, then ask them that question. Of course, some people bat the question off by making a joke of it, or they say something completely nebulous like ‘world peace’. But deep-down we all have a vision of the good life. And so it’s an easy starting point and a friendly way-in to begin to find out what are the idols of our hearts.

Lastly, how can LE be run?

Well, we’ve planned LE in such a way as to make it really flexible. You could run it one-to-one – in a home or coffee shop [check out this article from Barry on that idea], perhaps watching the films on a tablet – or you could host it as a larger event in a group setting. The basic idea is that every session includes two films (one of which is a talk) and two discussion times, where you’re encouraged to interact with the Bible. One session could be run in an hour and the whole resource is made-up of seven sessions – but in theory you could also run an individual session as a stand-alone event or seminar if you wanted to focus in on that issue in a particular context. Be creative!

Nate, thanks so much for your time. Check out the trailer for Life Explored below, or click here to find out more information about how to get a copy of Life Explored.

September 16, 2016 by robinham

Interview, Social Media

Go Chatter, Video Ministry, & That John Lewis Ad Re-Make – An Interview with Dan Rackham

It was a joy to recently interview Dan Rackham. Dan is the man behind the ‘Loved This Christmas’ John Lewis advert re-make in December 2015, which had over 135,000 views online, and was shared at over 500 events last Christmas. He now works as a Digital Content Evangelist under the banner of Go Chatter, whilst living in Liverpool. In his spare time he is into extreme-sports and travelling. We chatted about all things video, including his role with Go Chatter, and how individuals and churches can make the most of video as we seek to engage with our world.

—

– Hey Dan, first-up, have videos always been something you’ve been interested in creating?

No, not at all. I’ve not got a degree in film editing or anything like that! For a while I’ve been interested in Youtube, and found myself following a few prolific vloggers. Then about a year and a half ago, as part of my previous community worker role in Liverpool, I began wondering if there was a way to reach out to folk in the community through video.

So I tried going to local events, filming & visually documenting them, interviewing those involved, etc, and trying to do all that in fun way. I ended up starting my own Youtube channel and creating a weekly video for over a year.

Some of these videos would be picked up by local press and media, and so I ended up being offered press passes to events, etc. All this was great for getting to know people in the Liverpool community. I also tried to have roughly every fourth video as a bit of a window into the Christian faith, perhaps showcasing an event at church, or something of my own testimony, or a theme I’d be reflecting on.

– So how did that lead to the John Lewis advert re-make?

Well, the John Lewis video was just going to be one of my weekly videos – and then it took off really. Obviously, being a national advert, I realised a re-make had potential for a wider audience than just my local geographical area, but I never thought it would do as well as it did. I think the Youtube video had 135,000 viewings, but more will have seen it through Facebook too – and our website had 35k hits and over 500 churches requested to show the video.

– Tell us a bit about your current role with Go Chatter and how that came about?

A British-based Christian publisher & distributor called 10ofthose had kindly given us some free resources to give-away through the Loved This Christmas website. As they say, one thing led to another and around Easter this year they approached me about this Digital Content Evangelist role. They’d been wanting to develop more short, evangelistic videos – and I hadn’t come across lots of examples of individuals or organisations doing that year-round, so it seemed like an exciting opportunity.

We’ve called the project Go Chatter and the tagline is ‘Gospel Videos to Share & Chat About’ – ultimately the hope is to create video resources that people can ‘go’ and share and then chat about. There’s a great team here to bounce ideas off, and I’m grateful to a bunch of supportive friends who’ve been a fantastic sounding board so far.

– And what would you say to someone who would perhaps question whether creating online videos is an effective use of time and resources?

It’s a good question to ask, and I’m certainly not the sort of person who thinks having a social media presence is suddenly gonna bring mass revival. Personally, I’ve always seen the value of investing in one-to-one relationships. That’s got to be the bread and butter of sharing Jesus and loving people, and so for me being involved in a local church is at the heart of that too.

And yet we’ve got to face up to the reality that so much stuff is consumed on the internet. Sharing online is now just part and parcel of what we all do. And so having really engaging, high-quality content that just gets someone thinking about the Christian faith has got to be a really valuable tool for this aspect of life.

With this sort of project, I think the more people you reach, the more justifiable it becomes. For Loved This Christmas I spent £630 making the video and it took about 4 weeks of my time. I guess if only 100 people had seen the video, you’d perhaps then question whether it was the best use of time and money. Maybe I should have spent the time knocking on my neighbours’ doors, handing out Christmas cards, etc, which is what I’d done the previous year. This year just gone, Loved This Christmas meant I couldn’t do that, and yet I hope that the amount of people who saw the video meant that it was worth it.

Of course, another complication is that making something go viral is an art rather than a science – ultimately there’s no guaranteed formula that we can control. There’s 400 hours of video content uploaded to youtube every minute, and most videos will just be viewed 10 or 15 times. And so promotion and sharing – getting our videos out there, almost is as important as the content of the video. Certainly I don’t want to make videos for a job just because that’s what I get a kick out of.

– What’s your take on how well the Church is making the most of the opportunity of online video? Do you sense that in the UK there’s much going on?

There are others doing similar work – but, as I say, one of the challenges for all of us is getting it out there. Ultimately I’d love my role to be encouraging churches and individuals who are seeking to do a similar thing.

– I know a few of the videos you’ve done with 10ofthose as Go Chatter have already made a bit of a splash on social media. Tell us a bit about some of the videos you’ve put out since you’ve started.

Sure, we’ve done 6 videos so far with Go Chatter, plus there’s a further 3 I’m editing at the moment. A number of churches have got in touch to say they’ve used these videos publicly, which is encouraging.

We did a video for the Queen’s 90th Birthday, which seemed to get a positive response. There’s also one reflecting on some of the instability in our country at the moment, called We Need a Leader.

One of my favourites was filming in Wembley Stadium for our FA Cup Final video. We wanted to do something that people who loved football would really enjoy watching, and so we told the story of the FA Cup final hymn, Abide With Me.

Another video picked up on the popular idea of having a ‘bucket list’. And there’s also an interview with Olympian Debbie Flood, and a video reflecting on the fact we’ve been personally made by a Creator.

I think so far we’ve had enough positive response to know we’re doing something right – the key is to keep doing it and work hard at promotion and get the content more widely known and used.

– Is there any way that the Church can be involved in what you’re doing?

For me this is the most important question. I really don’t want Go Chatter to be my own little project, where I’m coming up with every idea and presenting every video. I want the vision behind this to become a resource which Christians all over the UK are feeding into, as well as using.

Firstly, a simple way to make this a reality is for people to feed in their ideas – get in touch!

Secondly, I’m always eager for people to look over scripts and be a second, third, fourth pair of eyes. I can safely say that every video I’ve done so far has been a much higher quality finished product when it’s had 4 or 5 people looking over a script.

But thirdly I’d love to team up with really creative people all over the UK to create a variety of different videos. For example, say you’re someone who’s written an evangelistic rap that you’ve performed in your local church – perhaps we could think how to film and produce it really nicely so that it’s a national, or even international, resource.

To connect, give me an email: dan [at] 10ofthose.com or get in touch on Twitter. We’re also hoping to launch a Go Chatter website very soon that will offer a collection of really good videos, all embedded in such a way as to help Christians think how they can use each of them.

– In terms of what an individual church could do with video, what would you suggest?

One thing I’d encourage is just to produce a little 2-minute video showcasing your church – this could be displayed on your front page or on your Facebook page. I think video has potential to communicate so much more than text or even photos. When people see you’re a bunch of fairly normal people, that’s massively helpful!

I’d also say resist making them too professional – lots of Youtube content isn’t the most professional out there. The latest smartphones will give incredible quality footage anyway. Go for genuine and authentic.

In terms of using video in churches, I think it’s a great idea but don’t make it the be all and end all or do it just for the sake of it. Beginning a church service with a video occasionally, perhaps to raise an issue, etc, can be helpful.

– Dan, thanks for your time. Before we go, the question I’m sure many people will be asking: can we expect to see another John Lewis mock-up from you this Christmas?!

Ha! Well, I hope so! I’m actually working on 2 Christmas videos at the moment: one an animation and another featuring a children’s nativity. I know that John Lewis tend to release their advert mid-November – so last year it was a bit of a mad dash to get our version out there asap – but if we think it’s got legs and lends itself to a thoughtful Christian re-make, then yes, we’ll probably give it a go!

—

You can catch Dan at the Premier Digital Conference on Saturday 12th November 2016, where he’ll be leading a seminar on using video as part of the conference’s overall theme of ‘Reach’.

You can subscribe to the Go Chatter Youtube Channel or subscribe to the 10ofthose mailing list to receive updates on the new videos, as well as book offers. When the Go Chatter website is up and running there will be a sign-up option there too.

September 1, 2016 by robinham

Page 5 of 6« First...«3 456 »

Primer, Theological ‘Fast-food’ & Staying Sharp Together – An Interview with David Shaw